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Finally changed my timing belt! (overly long)

14K views 42 replies 30 participants last post by  velo  
#1 ·
EDIT: This writeup has been refined (lotsa non-56k-friendly pictures, etc.) and moved to the Info Forum: Timing Belt writeup

So, I called the dealership to find out how much they get to change the timing belt, tensioner (old-style), and accessory belts on my '99 1.8T B5. They quoted me $600-700 AND said it would be a two-day job. For me this means being car-less for two days and my office is about 60 miles from the dealership. This inspired me to do it myself. Well, at 86,000 miles I have changed my own timing belt…and it was great!<p>I had planned to do it on Saturday, but weather conditions set me back a day. I really didn't want to do it on a Sunday in case it took longer than I expected (I don't have a Scirocco for back-up like Rusty does!).<p>So, here's the timeline and some of my observations (please excuse my blantant jumps back and forth between first and third person, as well as present and past tense). I've included some pictures so that others can see what it all looks like before attempting it themselves. Of course, all the pertinent "tear up your car at your own risk" disclaimers apply.:<p>Last Saturday: Took my daughter and her friends on our monthly trip to Home Depot's Kids' Club. This month they built treasure boxes (if you have kids you owe it to them and yourself to take them there!). Dropped kids back at home so I could shop unencumbered. Went to Target, bought a digital camera (Sony DSC-P51)…not the be-all end-all of digital cameras, but a really nice general-purpose picture taker and comes with 16-Mb Memory Stick, Ni-MH batteries, and charger…suh-weet! We've been wanting to get one for a while, but I kept putting it off (I'm cheap). But, since I just got my annual sick-leave buy-out check, the timing couldn't be better! Stopped by Advance Automotive and ordered the Haynes manual. Stopped by Lowes for a set of Hex sockets.<p>Monday: Surfed VW parts websites.<p>Tuesday: Ordered 128-Mb Memory Stick from Tiger-Direct…no running out of film for me!<p>Called ECS, ordered the following:
058.198.479 Timing Belt Kit $109.00
058.109.244 Timing Belt Roller $27.00
5PK-1300 Alt/PS Belt (5-rib) $10.79
4PK-0855 A/C Belt (4-rib) $11.69
also...
026.121.005K Water Pump $49.50
06A.145.710N DV (Audi TT type) $31.00
Freight: $26.02
Total: $265.00<p>Tom was a big help, Brian was patient (in spite of my numerous questions), Coleen was prompt in getting me the tracking number…and most of their prices can't be beat.<p>Wednesday: Jacked up hit counters at UPS and Airborne Express tracking sites.<p>Thursday: Bite nails waiting for call from my wife that my toys have arrived…Christmas comes early at the DaddyMatt household this year! Pick up Haynes manual at Advance; can tell right away that this was a great investment. Get home, inspect parts; find that ECS sent wrong A/C belt and no WP belt (partly my fault for not telling them which ones I needed for my model year and options). All other parts look great, timing belt is Dayco, 153 tooth (original was a Gates, though made in Germany), accessory belts are Conti's, downright beautiful looking belts, almost too pretty to hide under the hood!<p>Friday: Play with camera, keep checking <A HREF="http://www.weather.com" TARGET="_blank">http://www.weather.com</A>, hoping their forecast for Saturday (rain) is wrong. Kick self for not cleaning out garage last weekend. Xeroxed pertinent sections of Haynes to mark up with my notes. Go to Advance and Pep Boys in hopes of finding WP belt and correct A/C belt, buy closest match. Today's high temperature is a balmy 79F.<p>Saturday: Rains all day. Clean garage, occasionally gazing out at B5 in driveway. Study Haynes. Run out to Lowe's to buy another set of Hex sockets because I can't find the set I bought last week (I think I left them in the shopping cart…doh!). Go out to little hole-in the-wall Italian restaurant with wife and in-laws for incredible 4-hour dinner. Enjoyed it so much I actually forgot about the Passat for a while! Today's high temp is 70F, would've been a great day to work on the car if it hadn't been raining!<p>Sunday: Rain stops…Put car on ramps and started work. Outside temperature is 54F and climbing. Followed Haynes manual; very good write-up and pictures, they covered almost everything, step-by-step. Fabricated an "auxiliary voltage input" device so I could disconnect battery without losing power to radio, ECU, etc.
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<p>In a flash of Mr. Monk-like brilliance, I use a fishing lure box to keep track of nuts and bolts, labeling each compartment with the appropriate Haynes paragraph number:
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<p>Removed belly pan. Removed bumper cover (Haynes missed two screws in their writeup)
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...only hard part was separating hood release mechanism (small flat-blade screwdriver or two helps).
Removed bumper (discovered what Rusty meant about the headlight carriers being in the way, elbow grease helped here; if you turn the bolts just right, you can get them out…getting them back in is a bit harder).
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<p>Discovered another benefit of the LeBra (radiator is 4 years old and nearly bug-free)!
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<p>Removed one bolt so I could use it to get correct size threaded stock for homemade "Special Tool 3369".
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<p>Took it to Lowe's and Home Depot; thread gauge shows it's 8mm X 1.25 thread. Guess what…they don't have any 8mm X 1.25 bolts longer than 30mm, much less 8mm threaded stock! I bought the nearest thing: 5/16" X 12" threaded stock and am out the door under $2.00. Back home…5/16" stock proves to be less than ideal, but better than nothing…then I discover that the two (long) bumper bolts are 8mm x 1.25 thread and much stronger than the 5/16", yeah baby!
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<p>Unbolting power steering cooler lines and intercooler intake hose make the lock carrier easier to pull out (note accumulation of oil in intake hose…I think I remember somebody posting this as a common "Passat thing").
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<p>Finally, after checking that no hoses or wires are being stretched excessively, I pull the lock carrier into the service position and gaze upon the front of the 1.8-T in all it's glory!
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(FYI, photo doesn't show the 2x4's I used to hold the lock carrier in position but does show the factory snub mount.)
It is now much easier to get at the accessory belts. Before removing the belts, break loose the crankshaft pulley nuts for easier removal. Once the belts are off, it's time to pull the sparkplugs (relieves cylinder compression to make the crankshaft easier to turn). But first, I used my special narrow access vacuum tool to remove any dirt from the sparkplug wells.
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<p>Since I was due for new plugs, I had a fresh set of Denso #5061's standing by.
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<p>Next, remove the upper timing cover to reveal the cam gear timing marks and turn the crankshaft to verify that both sets of timing marks are lined up. Without turning the crankshaft, remove the crank pulley and lower timing cover. Voila, I give you the timing belt! (and evil original tensioner)
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<p>Once the lower timing cover is off, use a dab of white-out to put a timing mark on the crank sprocket; this way you can double-check the crankshaft position if you accidently move it (as I did).
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<p>I found that undoing the left bolt of the tensioner gave me some slack in the belt and made it easier to get it over all the pulleys. Also, I found that hand-turning the crankshaft sprocket a tooth or so counterclockwise made it easier to make the belt mesh with the sprocket. Once the old belt and tensioner are replaced, it looks something like this:
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<p>Now we pull the pin on the tensioner and hand-turn the crank through two revolutions to make sure everything is timed correctly…it is!<p>Since I need the car tomorrow (Monday), don't have a new water pump belt, and 7 PM is a bit late in the day to tear into the water pump, I decide to just replace the DV and call it quits for today. DV changeout is stupid easy with everything pulled apart; takes about 15 minutes, including digging up a used hose clamp to replace the single-use factory clamp. Now it's time to start putting it all back together. Alt./PS belt goes on like pie, but neither of the two A/C belts I bought fit. One's "too long", one's "too short", neither is "just right"…good thing I marked the original for direction of rotation. The two-piece water pump pulley is a real joy
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, to put back together but at least you know it's correctly tensioned once it's done. Everything else is just a matter of putting back together what I took apart. Complements to VW on this; everything went back together as tight as LEGO blocks. Outside temperature has dropped to 42F by the time I finish, so I decide to take the car off the ramp, shut the garage door, kick on the heater and clean up.<p>All-in-all, the job takes me 12 hrs from start to finish, including stopping to run to town, eat dinner on the workbench and take about 50 pictures. Next time it should be about a 4-hr job. So, was it worth doing myself? Let's see:<p>Parts: $265 (though I'm saving the water pump for later)
Tools: $45 (Hex bits, Torx bits and 5/16 threaded stock)
Book: $15 (Haynes manual)
Camera: $325 (including additional 128-Mb Memory Stick)
Total: $650 (about the same as the dealer's price)<p>I got a real feeling of accomplishment out of doing this job myself, and know it will be a breeze next time. For the price, I took care of the timing belt and my stock DV, before either went bad. I've got a water pump for later, some new tools, plus a cool digital camera! Not a bad deal in my book.<p>
[Modified by DaddyMatt, 2:08 AM 12/1/2002]


[Modified by DaddyMatt, 2:14 PM 12/1/2002]
 
#5 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (DaddyMatt)

Nice write up. I just did another T-belt/waterpump for a fellow B5er yesterday. I love doing this job, to me it's fun.
 
#7 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (b5bel)

B5Bel - Fun??? thats not what you said yesterday!!

Just kidding - you did a great job and I appreciated it. Although with DaddyMatt's great write up, I think next time, Ill try it myself (just hope b5bel you are willing to do housecalls after I mess it up)

Thanks again

and great write up!
 
#8 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (falltime)

Nice writeup! Thanks.

I know what you mean, doing things like this is very nice! I do almost all of the repairs myself (just yesterday I fixed the Tiptronic circuitboard under the gate, cost= "0", quote by dealer "at least 350!!!!"), not only saving stupid amounts of money, also, job done right, pride, sharing with others as "pay-back" what I've learned over the net.

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#9 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (DaddyMatt)

DaddyMatt,
Just wanted to thank you for sharing with us and providing all us B5 ers with such a great detailed, comprehensive visual report of your timing belt replacement job-one we all dread-and educating us.
 
#11 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (DaddyMatt)

Great job! Give yourself a pat on the back
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Bel is doing my belt next Saturday.
 
#13 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (HermanH)

Very nice Matt,

In retrospect, do you think you could do this without
removing the bumper the next time?
 
#14 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (Colin)

Thanks Matt, I appreciate this (and maybe the Mods can add a section for timing belt replacement to the Information section)
 
#15 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (Medrosje)

Hey Daddy Matt, not to be a stickler for details but you never mentioned in your post if it started up or not after the change over?!?!?!
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Noticed you live in Ocala, my grandparents love in Ocala, nice horse town.... Congrats on the job, I would have done my own at 90K but taking the bumper off I wasn;t in the mood for.
 
#16 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (danteshors)

Nice write-up! This needs to be put in the information section, so we can find it later and refer people to it that want to take on the job...
 
#17 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (DaddyMatt)

Nice write-up Man!
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And you're right, the feeling of doing the job yourself is like no other. Except in the case of doing the clutch in your 1.8T B5 5spd manual. Leave that one for the dealership.
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I have to ask you though, why didn't you replace the stock snub mount with the APR unit. You were right there!
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Never mind, you'll have to go back in to finish up the water pump, do it then. It's a really great little mod for $50 to do while you are working in that area anyway.
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Again, nice write-up and excelente pictures too!
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But kill the date thingy in the corner.
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#18 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (Chas)

Very well written up. Thanks, Matt! Glad you're on the road again.

I'm still not on-the-road. I'm in the dealer for the second time. An oil leak appeared two days after my work was done. I couldn't find the source, but there was a significant amount of oil in the turbo area. 1st trip to the dealer they said it was camshaft oil seal (even though I told them I checked it myself and did not find a leak). The dealer was lousy at putting my car back together. Broke the tabs on the cover to the airfilter housing. Put the bumper skin back on improperly, resulting in a bulge at the driver side headlight. Didn't even try to align the lock carrier, so the hood closes funny and the poly snub mount vibrates like hell all the time. PLUS it's still leaking oil.

I just took it back today for a second try. I asked for a tech with more experience and was told that the shop foreman worked on it the first time...
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I have this sinking feeling...
 
#20 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (Rusty)

Hi, everybody...thanks for all the accolades! I would have replied sooner, but my head was so swollen from reading your replies that I couldn't reach the keyboard!

atomicalex: Compared to a kitchen remodel, this procedure should be a breeze. BTW, if there is sufficient interest I may offer a GB on the "narrow access vacuum tool".

El Guapo: If you've had the stones to even OWN more than one Triumph, you shouldn't be intimidated by this!

AndyA6: Dittoes on all accounts. I've learned a lot from others at ClubB5, and wanted to "give back" to the community. I hope my post helps others who are tired of "the man keepin' them down"! ...oops, my militant side's showing.

HermanH: See my reply to AA, above.
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There are two sets of timing marks, one for the camshaft sprocket (notch on the sprocket, notch on the valve cover) and one for the crankshaft (notch on the crankshaft pulley, arrow on the lower timing cover). Since the lower timing cover must be removed to get to the timing belt, and the crankshaft pulley (aka damper pulley) must be removed to get to the lower timing cover, you temporarily lose these two timing marks while you're changing the belt. To remedy this, I put a tiny dab of white-out on the crankshaft sprocket and the block so I could make sure the crankshaft was back in time after the belt went on, prior to putting the cover and pulley back on.

Colin: Yeah, I think I could do it without removing the bumper, but then I wouldn't have the bumper bolts to use for my "3369" tools!!
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Seriously, I don't think it would be a big deal, but I think I'd need to use a universal extension to get to the lock carrier bolts. Which is easier? The jury's out on that one.

Medrosje: I'll be happy to entertain any such interest that the Mods have, and be honored to have any of my pictures selected (I have about fifty 1600x1200 pictures of the procedure and about forty pictures I took of the parts beforehand too). If the Mods express such interest, I'll be happy to do some cropping, etc. and do a neater writeup for the Info section (though it may take me a while to make time for it).

danteshors: Doh! I was hoping nobody would ask if it started up afterward. (It did) Nice to hear your grandparents are doing so well
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; but that's probably more info than we needed! BTW, you never actually mentioned where they live.
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Yeah, we like Ocala; it's now gotten big enough for most of the modern conveniences, but still has that "small town" feel. Your g-parents don't happen to live along the SR-200 corridor, do they? That's where we live, it's mostly retirement communities (some refer to it as "God's waiting room" or "the elephants' graveyard").

Chas: I've got a Tip, and heard that the snub mount is mainly a 5-speed thing. If this mod has some significant benefits with the Tip, I may get one for when I do the water pump. BTW, the date thing has been killed; I had it on mainly to keep track of the time I spent on the procedure.

Rusty: Bummer about your oil leak. Are you sure it's not the nearly-ubiquitous 1.8-T valve cover gasket leak? It really sounds like you got some "don't care" service work, since they didn't get the bumper skin lined up properly. Like I said in my original post, everything lined up perfectly when I put it back together...and I'm just some guy off the street, on his first attempt at it! The bumper skin did hang up a bit on the black plastic "headlight carrier" (shown in the fourth picture), but once I lined it up right, it slipped right into place. Hmmm, maybe that's why he's the foreman!

Everybody else: Thanks for all the props!

In short, the whole process (except for the two bolts in the wheelwells and adding your own timing marks) is well documented in the Haynes manual. Read it through and have all the right tools on hand before you start and you almost can't go wrong.

<![CDATA[Hi, everybody...thanks for all the accolades! I would have replied sooner, but my head was so swollen from reading your replies that I couldn't reach the keyboard!

atomicalex: Compared to a kitchen remodel, this procedure should be a breeze. BTW, if there is sufficient interest I may offer a GB on the "narrow access vacuum tool".

El Guapo: If you've had the stones to even OWN more than one Triumph, you shouldn't be intimidated by this!

AndyA6: Dittoes on all accounts. I've learned a lot from others at ClubB5, and wanted to "give back" to the community. I hope my post helps others who are tired of "the man keepin' them down"! ...oops, my militant side's showing.

HermanH: See my reply to AA, above.
Image
There are two sets of timing marks, one for the camshaft sprocket (notch on the sprocket, notch on the valve cover) and one for the crankshaft (notch on the crankshaft pulley, arrow on the lower timing cover). Since the lower timing cover must be removed to get to the timing belt, and the crankshaft pulley (aka damper pulley) must be removed to get to the lower timing cover, you temporarily lose these two timing marks while you're changing the belt. To remedy this, I put a tiny dab of white-out on the crankshaft sprocket and the block so I could make sure the crankshaft was back in time after the belt went on, prior to putting the cover and pulley back on.

Colin: Yeah, I think I could do it without removing the bumper, but then I wouldn't have the bumper bolts to use for my "3369" tools!!
Image
Seriously, I don't think it would be a big deal, but I think I'd need to use a universal extension to get to the lock carrier bolts. Which is easier? The jury's out on that one.

Medrosje: I'll be happy to entertain any such interest that the Mods have, and be honored to have any of my pictures selected (I have about fifty 1600x1200 pictures of the procedure and about forty pictures I took of the parts beforehand too). If the Mods express such interest, I'll be happy to do some cropping, etc. and do a neater writeup for the Info section (though it may take me a while to make time for it).

danteshors: Doh! I was hoping nobody would ask if it started up afterward. (It did) Nice to hear your grandparents are doing so well
Image
; but that's probably more info than we needed! BTW, you never actually mentioned where they live.
Image
Yeah, we like Ocala; it's now gotten big enough for most of the modern conveniences, but still has that "small town" feel. Your g-parents don't happen to live along the SR-200 corridor, do they? That's where we live, it's mostly retirement communities (some refer to it as "God's waiting room" or "the elephants' graveyard").

Chas: I've got a Tip, and heard that the snub mount is mainly a 5-speed thing. If this mod has some significant benefits with the Tip, I may get one for when I do the water pump. BTW, the date thing has been killed; I had it on mainly to keep track of the time I spent on the procedure.

Rusty: Bummer about your oil leak. Are you sure it's not the nearly-ubiquitous 1.8-T valve cover gasket leak? It really sounds like you got some "don't care" service work, since they didn't get the bumper skin lined up properly. Like I said in my original post, everything lined up perfectly when I put it back together...and I'm just some guy off the street, on his first attempt at it! The bumper skin did hang up a bit on
 
#21 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (DaddyMatt)

BTW, anybody know how to get the images to load quicker? I reduced the file sizes by lowering the resolution of the photos I posted, but they're still pretty slow to load (and I'm on Roadrunner at work)!
 
#22 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (DaddyMatt)

Excellent Writeup! Thanks. But you forgot one key detail... what did you have for dinner at the little Italian place? Also, I don't understand what the "speical tool 3369" you made is for. Danke.
 
#24 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (Macabre)

Excellent writeup, really nice attention to detail.
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I am needing to do a timing belt change, and am on the fence of whether I should do it or have my mechanic cousin do it.
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Pat yourself on the back!
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#25 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (Macabre)

^^ Pics loaded fine for me...

Great write up!!!
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I have a V6 and still read the whole thing!

Maybe they can archieve the post for you... it really is very good!

Pete
 
#26 ·
Re: Finally changed my timing belt! (vitaminB5)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Also, I don't understand what the "speical tool 3369" you made is for. Danke.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm pretty sure the special tool 3369 (lock carrier), is a long bolt-type of tool designed to hold up the engine, since you need to remove the front engine mount.