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Help with Suspension Problem plz!!

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Yungfab

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I got my b&g springs and bilstein sport shocks installed(still on stock adelaides) on tuesday and now my camber and toe are all out of spec. Is this normal? I havent heard of that many passats with this type of problem. What can i have done to fix everything? Heres alignment pic: http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/adelani@sbcglobal.net/lst?.dir=/Dobbs&.src=ph&.view=

<![CDATA[I got my b&g springs and bilstein sport shocks installed(still on stock adelaides) on tuesday and now my camber and toe are all out of spec. Is this normal? I havent heard of that many passats with this type of problem. What can i have done to fix everything? Heres alignment pic: http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/adelani@sbcglobal.net/lst?.dir=/Dobbs&.src=ph&.view=

[Modified by Yungfab, 8:11 PM 3/1/2003]
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (b5-turbonium)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>when you change out the suspension you need an alignment afterwards
Image


who did it for you? they probably messed with the tie-rod or soemthing whne they shouldnt have.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yea i went to get the alignment and no they didnt mess with the tie rod
 
#7 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (Yungfab)

You need a subframe adjustment/alignment. The camber needs to be equalized and
the caster differential seems too high. Usually it is 1* more on left not 2. I think your
car was probably pretty screwed up before the suspension install. The install really
does not affect the caster or camber differential. It increases camber equally and screws
up the toe settings.
PZ.
 
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#8 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (PZ)

Yikes!! Just out of curiosity, which B&G springs did you get? Was it the 1.6" or the Autobahn?
 
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Discussion starter · #10 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (PZ)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> You need a subframe adjustment/alignment. The camber needs to be equalized and
the caster differential seems too high. Usually it is 1* more on left not 2. I think your
car was probably pretty screwed up before the suspension install. The install really
does not affect the caster or camber differential. It increases camber equally and screws
up the toe settings.
PZ.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Do u think i should put my old suspension back on & see what happens? I know if i go to the dealer now they will tell me i voided my suspension warranty.
 
#11 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (Yungfab)

Well (and I could be wrong here since I don't have my manual), but I don't think the suspension is covered under the powertrain warranty, so I doubt it would make a difference whether or not you put your old shocks/springs back on.
 
#12 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (Yungfab)

PZ knows what he's talking about by the sound of it.

And the rear toe is off enough you may need a whole axle, or hopefully just a right side stub axle.

However, I'm not used to what it should look like with a custom suspension.

Regardless, they didn't equalize the front or rear and your thrust angle is gawdawful.

Take it to someone who will spend some time with it.

**They will only spend time with it if you PAY them for their time. I, for example, would not touch your car if all you were willing to pay was the regular alignment charge.

<![CDATA[PZ knows what he's talking about by the sound of it.

And the rear toe is off enough you may need a whole axle, or hopefully just a right side stub axle.

However, I'm not used to what it should look like with a custom suspension.

Regardless, they didn't equalize the front or rear and your thrust angle is gawdawful.

Take it to someone who will spend some time with it.

**They will only spend time with it if you PAY them for their time. I, for example, would not touch your car if all you were willing to pay was the regular alignment charge.

[Modified by Sharky, 12:26 PM 3/2/2003]
 
#13 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (Yungfab)

Just to let you know my expreince with these things, you will always have more neg. camber up front due to lowering the suspension. The 4link suspension is designed to increase camber angle as the suspension collapses. By lowering it, you have in effect, preloaded the suspension, as far as the 4 link suspension is concerned. I had mine done properly and both sides showed -1.4 deg. and there's nothing VW can do about that. The rears are another matter. shims usually cure that.

I see this as sort of getting what you expected. If you want a sportier looking car, expect a little bit of 'sport'. I like the way my car handled but the tirewear is quite annoying. I tried to correct this with a camber kit but decided it was too much work for a shadetree mechanic so I went back to stock.

<![CDATA[Just to let you know my expreince with these things, you will always have more neg. camber up front due to lowering the suspension. The 4link suspension is designed to increase camber angle as the suspension collapses. By lowering it, you have in effect, preloaded the suspension, as far as the 4 link suspension is concerned. I had mine done properly and both sides showed -1.4 deg. and there's nothing VW can do about that. The rears are another matter. shims usually cure that.

I see this as sort of getting what you expected. If you want a sportier looking car, expect a little bit of 'sport'. I like the way my car handled but the tirewear is quite annoying. I tried to correct this with a camber kit but decided it was too much work for a shadetree mechanic so I went back to stock.

[Modified by HermanH, 12:00 PM 3/2/2003]
 
Discussion starter · #14 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (PZ)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR> You need a subframe adjustment/alignment. The camber needs to be equalized and
the caster differential seems too high. Usually it is 1* more on left not 2. I think your
car was probably pretty screwed up before the suspension install. The install really
does not affect the caster or camber differential. It increases camber equally and screws
up the toe settings.
PZ.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Since my caster differential is too high and my car was probably pretty screwed up before the suspension install, do u think that if i put the stock suspension back on and if there still is a problem the dealer will fix it since im still under warranty?
 
#15 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (Yungfab)

Unless you bought it used and certified the warranty was 2yr/24k. The 10yr/100k is
powertrain and would not cover alignment.
Take it to an Audi dealer and tell them you need a subframe adjustment/alignment.
That will fix the front. For the rear there is not much you can do unless you want to get
into shims or replacement parts.
PZ.
 
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#17 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (jafarrar)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>A good alignment tech should be able to take care of this easily. Rear shims will take care of the rear camber and toe. No need to replace axle or other parts<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good luck! I concur 100% with Sharky's analysis. Your big problem is the left-right differences in camber and caster, not the absolute values of each. You need to shift the subframe to fix this, but alignment techs are going to want to do that...nor would I want most of them to try! My suggestion is to get a body shop to do it, or do it yourself and have the alignment re-checked afterward. Here's a thread detailing my own experience, which worked out quite well:
http://clubb5.zeroforum.com/zerothread?id=19394
 
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#19 ·
Re: Help with Suspension Problem plz!! (rderize)

I bought a used 99 passat and I knew the alignment was out. I had our alignment tech at work check it and he fixed everything perfect. My alignment was out worse than yours. And now is right on the money. Most body shops do not have alignment machines. The subframe is not hard to adjust if the tech knows what he is doing.
 
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