Volkswagen Passat Forum banner
1 - 20 of 42 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
411 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
The taligentx.com tiptronic DIY is awesome (http://www.taligentx.com/passat/maintenance/atfchange/), but sometimes I wish I had a little more hand-holding. Rather than ask a million questions of dozens of PW members, I took the best of the above write-up, went painstakingly slow while performing the work myself, then made my own overly-detailed DIY. Sorry if it's wordy. I figured some folks might actually find it useful.

Tiptronic part numbers & my lame how to:

I'm not a pro and have not had any formal training. The following how-to in no way constitutes professional advice. Follow at your own risk.

For trans codes DDT, DRD, EFP & EKC (mine is an EFP according to the sticker in my owner's manual), VW lists the gasket as part # 01V 321 371 and the filter as 01V 325 429. You also will need a new drain plug (replaced every time and has its own integrated washer), part # 01V 321 377. The check/fill plug needs a new sealing washer every time it is removed (sealing washer part #: 01V 321 379).

Start the process with a cold engine and transmission and the vehicle level. I pulled mine up on my Rhino ramps, then had the back end up on jackstands. It was close enough to level and seems to have worked out just fine for me. Keep in mind that doing it this way will leave your front (drive) wheels on ramps when it comes time to shift through the dears to allow new fluid to flow through the transmission. This means stomping the brake pedal HARD. Some folks have suggested backing the car on to ramps, then putting the front on jackstands. Seems to be a matter of personal preference. I did what was easiest. Your mileage may vary

Check to make sure you can loosen the drain and check/fill plugs before draining all the fluid. Position a drain pan large enough to hold about 5 liters of old fluid under the transmission drain plug (this one takes an 8mm hex head), open it up and let drain for a while. Once it's drained, remove the check/fill well plug using a 17mm hex driver. Then proceed to loosen and remove all 27 hex head bolts holding the pan to the tranny (part # 01V 321 373 in case you strip any of their heads, but beware--they are something like $2 each). These are T27 Torx head bolts. Take care to not bend or warp the pan in any way. Any warpage will result in a nice, messy leak. I placed a box underneath the pan that was just about the right size. It helped hold it in place while I worked to get all 27 bolts out. There will be some leftover fluid in the pan.

Clean up the now-removed tranny oil pan. Mine had 6 magnets that were covered not so much in little, hairy metal particles as much as a think, black goop. Not a good sign I thought. I used a Scotch Brite pad to clean away the remnants of the old gasket on both the pan and the body of the tranny.

Despite the rather ominous warning from the transmission manufacturer, "WARNING: Use of incorrect lubricant may cause transmission failure!" I used Pentosin ATF-1. There's been a lot of talk about which fluid to use. I chose Pentosin because they are an OEM supplier, came highly recommended, and I had already bled and filled two cars' brakes with Pentosin brand brake fluid with great success. Looking at the label, you can see it's VW-approved. If you insist on getting the dealer stuff, it's part # G 052 162 A2. The ZF-approved fluid is Esso LT 71141. Since it is near impossible for mere mortals to obtain LT 71141, I felt OK using a fluid that was VW-approved.



Bolt the pan back up to the car using a star pattern to avoid warping. The pan bolts are torqued to 7 ft. lbs. Then install the new drain plug and torque to 30 ft. lbs. Decide whether you want to mimic the VW filler tool (I did and semi-regret it, as it took a LONG time to fill using gravity alone) or build your own pumping apparatus. My filling rig consisted of some clear tubing, a short length of copper tubing I bent to fit the check/fill well and a tall funnel. You're gonna make a mess, so don't worry too much about the fill. Just keep a supply of shop rags or paper towels handy.

Begin refilling the ATF. To do an accurate check of the fluid level, the fluid itself needs to be between 95 and 113 degrees F (35 & 45 degrees C). This means getting around 4 liters of new fluid in, starting the car, then letting it warm up. Using an infrared "laser" thermometer, I was able to determine there's about a 10 degree differential between the pan temp and the fluid temp. For me, this meant that when the pan read 113 degrees, the fluid was 123 degrees. Once you have about 4 liters of the ATF filled and with the car started, run the gear selector through the gears a few times to get the fluid moving. Hold each gear for 20 seconds or so. Be sure to go through each gear, then put it back in Park. Finish filling with your remaining ATF. With the engine at idle speed and the fluid at the correct temp, it's full when fluid begins to overflow from the fill hole. Since the overflow will sorta gush out at first, be patient and allow it to slow to a very slow drip. Wipe it dry as much as possible and install the plug. Mine sucked down roughly 5.5-6 liters of new ATF.

Use a new sealing washer and torque the giant 17mm check/fill plug to 59 ft lbs. Wipe up the mess in your garage and enjoy driving your car.

Here are a few notes from the manual:
  • Before checking ATF level, be certain the vehicle is level
  • Selector (shifter) must be in Park and the engine running at idle speed with a/c switched off (The Bentley manual and ZF's own documentation differ here. Bentley says a/c switched off. ZF says "Start the engine (large consumers, such as A/C should be switched on)." I left the a/c off. Perhaps somebody could shed some light on this one.)
  • If ATF level is checked when fluid temp is too low, over filling could result
  • If ATF level is checked when fluid temp is too high, under filling could result
  • Under filling or over filling will affect the transmission's performance and could eventually result in damage
The spare parts/instruction PDF from ZF referenced in the taligentx.com write-up is awesome. It contains step-by-step instructions on filling if you feel either of the amateur write-ups just don't cut it. You'll find it on ZF's site here: http://www.zf.com/na/Home/M9/M12/M27/M367/5HP19FL.pdf

I also stumbled on this very interesting info. Useful for folks tuning their Passats for greater horsepower:
http://www.zf.com/ZF_ProductDB/user...pID=&businessUnitShortcut=&languageISOCode=en
Basically it states: 5 HP 19 FL (model #), Front (drive), 5 (gears), 310 NM (initial torque -- not sure exactly what that means, but to me it looks like the Tiptronic in our Passats will only handle up to about 228 lbs-ft of torque).

If you end up doing this service yourself, you'll probably be interested in doing the differential fluid as well. It's supposed to be topped off every 30,000 miles. I'd feel better about draining and refilling as opposed to simply replenishing. It's a very simple procedure and there's already a great write-up here on PW. Link, for convenience:
http://www.passatworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154685



keywords: tiptronic; transmission; ATF; flush; tiptronic service; transmission fluid; transmission specs; ZF; transmission torque specs; transmission filter; differential; gear oil
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
2,410 Posts
Good job kid.

Just what I was asking for.

Now if I only had the time to do this I would be set.
 

·
PassatWorld Staff
Joined
·
12,264 Posts
Yes, I can.

A pan drop should have resulted in a refill of about 6 qts. Did you change the filter?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,252 Posts
Seems like he said he emptied a bottle of ATF into the pan before bolting it back up. Then it sucked up 5qts doing the final filling.

Also maybe edit it to say to remove the 17mm hex before the 8mm drain plug. It would stink to drain the ATF and then find out you can't open up the 17mm to fill the tranny for some reason. But that's just me...anyways nice write up!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
239 Posts
something to think about

Good write-up.

I think even before 1 drop of fluid comes out, make sure that all the screws, filler cap and overflow cap can be removed buy loosening them. You would hate to drain all the fluid and find out that you cant remove that 17mm nut.

The biggest question that I had was which gear the car should be in when topping-off. After running thru all the gears for 10sec each, I found that reverse held more fluid then in park or drive. After topping in reverse, the fluid would gush-out if I moved it to drive or park. Since its better to slightly overfill then underfill, I topped it off in reverse.

Since my driveway is slopped, I levelled my car on ramps for the front and instead of jacks, I jacked up the rear and let the rear tire rest on some boards. Something about me underneith a running car, my girlfriend changing gears while a car on jackstands really doesnt make me feel very safe.


I like your idea about using a box or something to support the pan during installation. I used some high heat gasked maker to hold the gasked in place so it doesnt shift.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
411 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks guys

Yeah. I had a box that was nearly perfect size sitting right next to me in the garage. Seemed almost too perfect. Setting the pan with the 1 liter of ATF already in it made my life much easier. And it put my mind at ease as far as not warping the pan.

Great idea and suggestions on the drain and fill plugs. Better safe than sorry. I'll edit my original post to include this info. I suppose you run the risk of bending or otherwise messing up the pan if you are trying to get these loose when it has already been removed.

The silicone gasket goo trick is a good one. I did the same thing, but forgot to include it in the write-up. It was just what I needed to keep the new rubber gasket in place while I worked to get the pan back in place.

And I will admit to a mistake. I overfilled and freaked out when I discovered a leak the next day. I felt sick when I saw the tiny pool of ATF on my garage floor. I originally thought I had screwed up the new gasket. Just to double check everything, I warmed up the tranny and fluid by driving around the block a few times. I checked the temp of the pan and proceeded to remove the check plug. Needless to say, a fair amount of ATF gushed out. I made doubly sure everything was at the correct temp and waited until the fluid came out as a very slight drip (as per the Bentley manual). I guess the leak was from the overfill and caused the fluid to seep out past the gasket (the bolts holding the pan are only torqued to 7 ft lbs.).

And for the record, I'd rather change my timing belt a half dozen more times instead of flushing the tiptronic trans ever again. At least I have a cool little pin as a souvenir ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
411 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
A pan drop should have resulted in a refill of about 6 qts. Did you change the filter?
I did change the filter. As mentioned above, I filled the pan with a liter of ATF before even putting it back on the car. Cheating, I suppose.

I'm gonna re-check the fluid level in about a week. Hopefully all will be well with my tranny. So far no strange sounds, smells or shifting.

Glad to finally be able to give back to the PW community :thumbup:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
The fill plug can be a bear to get off. Mine was so tight, I thought I was going to break something. I used a propane torch to heat the pan (not the plug) for about a minute. I then waited another minute for the heat to equalize and the plug then came out very easily.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
47 Posts
hey guys when i call the dealer i asked about getting the fluid changed in my trip tranny in my 02 passat and he said the fluid was lifetime and didn't need to be changed also i called about the antifreeze and he said the same exact thing. whats up with this guy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,873 Posts
hey guys when i call the dealer i asked about getting the fluid changed in my trip tranny in my 02 passat and he said the fluid was lifetime and didn't need to be changed also i called about the antifreeze and he said the same exact thing. whats up with this guy.
They tell you that, but its not true, both should be flushed at some point, 70-100k for atf.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
411 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Funny how the dealership and owner's manual both say the fluids are lifetime. Weird thing was, I had no trouble at all finding things like the correct fluids, gaskets, etc. to do my flush/change. Since I did a lot more than just my Tip tranny, I can tell you from experience that the fluids most definitely need to be changed if you plan to keep your car for a while. My coolant was an awful, chocolate milk-colored mess instead of a nice, bright pink (indicating contamination with some other coolant or fluid at some point). And the ATF was a bit of a mess as well. Goopy, sludgy, messy gunk that I was more than happy to get out of my car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Just a little added info and some repeated info:

For my '05 Passat TDI, after verifying that my transmission code is GMR (by looking at the sticker in the spare tire well) and reviewing the ETKA parts listing, the transmission is the 01V 5 speed tiptronic made by ZF and the correct fluid is G052162A2.

I contacted TDIPARTS.com and asked them why they listed a different fluid (G052990A2). Their answer was that they believed it was correct.
The G052990A2 fluid is for use in a #09A transmission (is this a DSG?).
I believe their website is wrong!

Best way is to verify your tranny code and then get the fluid based on that code. I think all the '05 Passat TDI's have the 01v transmission.

Now, this brings up another question that is somewhat contentious. What is an approved substitute for this G052162A2 fluid ($12.00 bottle)?
http://www.taligentx.com/passat/main.../atfchange/) lists a few substitutes: Valvoline Mercon V, Quaker State Multi-use ATF, Pennzoil Multi-use ATF. Anybody tried any of these alternates?

The part numbers for servicing the tranny are as follows:
Transmission fluid -- G 052 162 A2 ~ $12.00 liter for Pentosin Brand
Check/fill plug seal -- 01V 321 379
Drain plug & seal -- 01V 321 377 (seal & drain plug are only available together
Pan gasket -- 01V 321 371
Filter -- 01V 325 429
Filter seal -- 01V 325 443

Possible alternate fluids:
Quaker State/Pennzoil Multi-Vehicle ATF: $3.00/quart
Valvoline MERCON V ATF: $3.00/quart
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
220 Posts
I pulled mine up on my Rhino ramps, then had the back end up on jackstands. It was close enough to level and seems to have worked out just fine for me. Your mileage may vary.
[/LIST]
Hey, very nice write-up!! But the above quoted part caught my attention. If your front tires on Rhino ramps, what happens when you start shifting trough the gears. Will the front wheels not begin to spin? You'll drive right off the ramps. Since you wrote this to provide a bit more "hand-holding", maybe a phrase about running through gears when on ONLY on Jack Stands.

What do you think?

Or did I miss something? Hey its late. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,317 Posts
Hey, very nice write-up!! But the above quoted part caught my attention. If your front tires on Rhino ramps, what happens when you start shifting trough the gears. Will the front wheels not begin to spin? You'll drive right off the ramps. Since you wrote this to provide a bit more "hand-holding", maybe a phrase about running through gears when on ONLY on Jack Stands.

What do you think?

Or did I miss something? Hey its late. :)
I was thinking exactly the same thing. How do you run thru the gears if the front is on ramps and not jackstands?:confused:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
411 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I was thinking exactly the same thing. How do you run thru the gears if the front is on ramps and not jackstands?:confused:

First of all, you guys did read where I stated I am not a professional, right? :)

Truth be told, I mashed the brake pedal while I shifted into each gear and let it sit there for a minute or so. Is there anything wrong with this method, or do the wheels actually need to spin around while going through the gears? Keep in mind, the term "noobs" is right in my thread title, so I may have been completely wrong in my thinking.

Thanks for any help and additional input. The more info the better.
 
1 - 20 of 42 Posts
Top