[smalltownguy2]

On my way to work a few weeks ago, climbing a hill and all of a sudden I lose acceleration, power steering, and battery light comes on. "Huh," I said. Pull over to the side of the road, turn the key off and back on - just starter whine. Ooops. Timing belt failure.

276,000 miles, and the current belt was done at 205,000. Looks like I was the victim of bad luck. I did have an engine ticking noise at 260,000, and after unsuccessfully diagnosing it (and replacing) the cam chain tensioner, discovered a failed timing belt tensioner. Looks like the belt took unnecessary wear and caused premature failure.

Well, I'm lucky enough to have access to a large heated shop and unlimited time. So, I decided to pull the head last night:

Pistons look good, no serious damage.

Head removed:

Inspection revealed at least 8 valves damaged (definitely the intake valves near the edge), and maybe more.

I have a local shop nearby that specializes in head work, so I'll bring it over and get it rebuilt.

This is no longer my daily driver, so I can take my time with it. I need to start a catalog of parts for this job, and I figured I would document the repair here as best I can.

So far I believe I need:

Complete timing belt kit, including:

• timing belt
• water pump & gasket
• timing belt tensioner
• tensioner roller
• idler roller
• thermostat with o-ring
• A/S belt
• P/S belt
• Coolant

head gasket kit, including:

• head gasket
• exhaust manifold gasket
• intake manifold gasket
• valve stem seals
• coolant flange gasket
• camshaft seals

oil dipstick tube

coolant temperature sensor & o-ring

head bolt set

What am I missing? Where's the best place for me to do my shopping for all of these parts?

 

[cchief22]

do you have in service position?

 

[smalltownguy2]

do you have in service position?

Yes. You pretty much HAVE to move the lock carrier forward to get at some of the fasteners off to remove the head. Way ahead of you there.

 

[Iowegian]

I didn't see new valves on the list but that's an obvious need. Head bolts often come with the head gasket kit. Shop around the usual suppliers since prices will vary and the manufacturers are mostly identical regardless of who sells the kits.

And since you're that far into it and have the time and space, at that mileage I would inspect/clean/replace the entire PCV system, replace the oil cooler gasket and any other hoses, mounts, etc that look suspect. Another option would be to check out the turbo now that's it off and has 275k on it.

 

[ylwagon]

Where's the best place for me to do my shopping for all of these parts?

A number of sources are available; I tend to use autohausaz.com mostly out of habit, but not exclusively. Over $48 the shipping is included, which yours will obviously be.

 

[PZ]

At the least, new seals for the coolant flange but a replacement flange is a good idea. New heater hoses (and maybe all hoses) if they are original, the plastic connectors would be very weak by now and moving them could easily induce failure at the 1st pressurization of the system.

 

[smalltownguy2]

I didn't see new valves on the list but that's an obvious need. Head bolts often come with the head gasket kit. Shop around the usual suppliers since prices will vary and the manufacturers are mostly identical regardless of who sells the kits.

And since you're that far into it and have the time and space, at that mileage I would inspect/clean/replace the entire PCV system, replace the oil cooler gasket and any other hoses, mounts, etc that look suspect. Another option would be to check out the turbo now that's it off and has 275k on it.

Turbo is still connected, I removed the head with the exhaust manifold still attached. I separated it at the 3 bolts at the bottom of the exhaust manifold. If I wanted to replace the turbo, how much more work to remove and reinstall is it?

At the least, new seals for the coolant flange but a replacement flange is a good idea. New heater hoses (and maybe all hoses) if they are original, the plastic connectors would be very weak by now and moving them could easily induce failure at the 1st pressurization of the system.

Coolant flange was just replaced, yes it was leaking about 20K ago. Both heater core hoses done too.

Valves will be supplied by the machine shop that's doing the head work.

 

[cchief22]

turbo is pretty easy ,the reason I asked about service position ,with the mileage and age I would drop A/C compressor and take a looksie, feelsie of turbo coolant lines especially the one from the block which gets "punky" over time,the wastegate pressure hoses ,heat in that area takes it's toll, and a look at the starter and its condition especially the little braided copper shunt that goes between the solenoid and starter body (always suspect when from a harsh climate)

 

[Hirnbeiss]

With this mileage I would consider replacing the starter and alternator (at least the regulator) while access is better. Possibly also AC compressor and receiver dryer, but you’re in WI, so maybe it has led a comfortable life compared to mine.

 

[kutcht1]

So at 260,000 miles timing belt tensioner was replaced and belt snaps at 276,000. When the tensioner was giving signs of failing why not just do the entire kit at that point when all is apart already? It is usually not the belt that fails, it is another component that causes the belt to fail. The service interval for these engines really should be around 60,000 miles anyway. Hope all goes well with the head rebuild.:thumbup:
TomK

 

[AndreasPassat]

When I go that deep into an engine job and need a laundry list of parts I usually shop around.
The last big rebuild a did (my wife's 2003 GLX - complete motor rebuild) I sourced from the following:

https://www.ecstuning.com/
https://www.fcpeuro.com/
https://www.autohausaz.com/
https://www.shopdap.com/
https://www.germanautosupply.com/
German Auto Parts :: Homepage


Each place is good for certain things. The last three on the list have changed quite a bit in the last few years so they may not be helpful for what your after.

Just as an example, when I rebuilt my wife's GLX V6 I needed new piston rings, most places didn't even list them, Genuine Audi/VW were around $150 per set. That's 6 sets needed for the engine!

After poking around a bit I found Goetze brand piston rings (same brand from factory) at shopdap.com for $17 a set, 6 sets needed.

That's a price difference of $800 just on piston rings!!

For someone who is just picking up a few items, ECS Tuning and FCP Euro are the way to go. ECS Tuning sells every VW part under the sun, even if not listed on the web site they can get the factory original part.
FCP Euro is in direct competition with ECS so they have that ridiculously unheard of LIFETIME replacement policy, on all parts.

 

[smalltownguy2]

The patient, waiting for a heart transplant....

 

[ylwagon]

Be sure to set the crank pulley marks and the cam sprocket timing marks aligned before plopping the rebuild head on the block.

 

[smalltownguy2]

Got the head installed last night. Stopped during the timing belt job since there were a few parts we discovered as we removed the intake manifold and vacuum lines. The PCV valve (suction jet pump) was cracked in half, so I need a replacement. And one of our vacuum lines (the one that clips into the front of the timing belt cover) was never replaced with silicone, so I'm going to grab a length of silicone tubing today and we'll continue the job tonight.

We decided to swing the lock carrier all the way open like a gate to make the job easier.

 

[4zfed]

How much was the head rebuild? I always pick up used heads at the junkyard for about $60 haven't had a problem yet (after 6 or 7 builds). The fact that you are doing the r & r yourself saves the bulk of the money. I wonder if anyone still pays a shop to do all the work for broken timing belt. I think that generally costs $3k to $5k depending where you are and who is doing the work, and I can't see anyone throwing that kind of money at these old cars anymore.

 

[smalltownguy2]

The complete re-valve job was $825. $325 for labor and $500 for 20 new OEM valves and 8 new brass sleeves for the exhaust valves.

I'm about $1500 into parts and labor so far. I'll probably throw my mechanic buddy a couple hundred bucks once we're all buttoned back up again.

 

[4zfed]

$1,700 is some pretty good money on a car that is probably worth around $2k. I salute you for doing the work yourself and keeping a good car on the road though. I have a goal to keep our family in B5 Passats for another 4 years or so. I do the work myself but have limits in mind for total cost per car per year. Best of luck with yours.

 

[smalltownguy2]

Tonight we'll do the timing belt job.

What's the best method for toothing on the belt? Start at the crank pulley and go right over the water pump, then camshaft pulley, or start at the bottom and go left over the tensioner, roller, and cam, sliding on over the water pump?

We started right Tuesday night and had some difficulty keeping the belt engaged on the bottom crank pulley once we went over the top of the camshaft pulley. The belt kept wanting to pull to the right, hopping a tooth before we could engage the tensioner.

 

[PZ]

I start by turning the crank counter clockwise by 1 tooth. Do not install the top bolt on the tension damper and leave the lower one slightly loose with the damper off the pulley to the left.

Then install on the crank and up over the water pump, then camshaft pulley and then over the damper pulley. I hold the belt on the crank pulley with my left hand and place the belt with my right.

Do not pull too tight, but you can try to keep tension on both sides of the belt if you have extra helping hands. Hold tension with the damper pulley and slide the tension damper into place. Make sure belt is fully seated in all pulleys.

Keeping tension on the roller, turn crank clockwise into place. Place a 8-10mm spacer between the damper and pulley (for AUG/AWM with adjustable pre-tension) and tension adjustable pulley. I make it tight enough so belt will not twist. This should result in the marks lined up perfectly (1/2 tooth to the right on cam mark).

 

[cchief22]

for what its worth..... I lined up crank (serpentine belt)pulley to timing mark on cover plate, reached inside and put paint line/mark on crank "toothed" pulley and a corresponding mark on engine block. Took off outer pulley and cover. Now as you did run belt from engine cogged pulley over water pump to cam cogged pulley, I wedged a piece of wood (at about 9 o'clock) between aluminum engine housing and cogged pulley and belt to hold in place then tensioned to Bentley instructions , then before doing anything put cover on and outer pulley to double check to mark on cover to outer pulley......