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Discussion Starter #1
Has anybody found a manufacturer that publishes spring rates? I don't have the cash for coilovers and I don't understand why this information is so hard to get for these cars.

Does anybody know the rates for the stock springs?
 

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The spring vendors are collective asses. None of them deserve our business, but what are we gonna do?
 

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I believe most sport springs have a final rate of around 300-400 the more sport/race the higher the number but they are progressive springs not linear. the final spring rate will depend on the amount of coils in the spring and their diameters.

So I assume stock would be around 200-250... but not sure.

I designed my own coilovers and used a linear rate spring of 600/650 ;)

but then again my car doesn't like bumps nearly as much as the stock suspension did!
 

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Discussion Starter #5
So at least it's not just me.

I'm about to do some drastic changes to my suspension but after the clutch I don't much in the way of funds. I'll figure somthing out.
 

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Hey Bill, long time no speak. Still got the coupe? IIRC ground control has spring rate info for the eibach stuff they seel, maybe a good start point.
 

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well...

scirocco78 said:
So at least it's not just me.

I'm about to do some drastic changes to my suspension but after the clutch I don't much in the way of funds. I'll figure somthing out.

My coilover system took almost a year of design work and adjustments to get it built and installed.

Most of the money was tied up with the installation since I had my shop work on it. I've gone through 3 sets of springs to get the correct rates and heights to work with the coilover design. Its still slightly off due to the original design to include a progressive spring.
 

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I thought the H&R combo were somewhere like 225/175? 4Mo is probably different though, with a different rear geometry.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Gregor56 said:
Hey Bill, long time no speak. Still got the coupe? IIRC ground control has spring rate info for the eibach stuff they seel, maybe a good start point.

Yep, I just looked at it yesterday. I'm gonna have to peek under it this spring to make sure it's not rusting away.

I've got the Shine Racing linear springs on the front again.This time with some custom made aluminium perches. I'm poking and prodding to get some help from Dick to figuring out some rears and make sure the fronts will be OK with the passat FWD since he designed them for a quattro. The passat SHOULD be lighter.
 

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scirocco78 said:
... I'm about to do some drastic changes to my suspension but after the clutch I don't much in the way of funds...
Have you tried removing the sway bars yet? That's a drastic change, it's easy, it's free, and easily reversible. Try it. I dare you. I double-dog dare you... :)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Well Rusty, I have a date with some scales, a spring rate tester and some pretty cool software this weekend. It looks like I'm going to finally figure this stuff out. I don't know if it will all get done this weekend, but I'll get it started! Maybe there will be market for this when I'm done??????
 

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Stock size springs with known linear rates are avail

never mind. .... . note to self, read the whole darn thread before posting.

:)
Chris
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Thanks for the info Nenad!

This weekend was a no go for me. The guy with all of the cool toys isn't feeling well :( so we're going to try next weekend.
 

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Spring Rates - Shine Racing

Guys, I just got off the phone with Dick from Shine Racing looking for some addtional info on their rear swaybars and we ended up chatting about suspension. He asked me what I was running and when I said the H&R/Billstein setup he said I made a "big mistake" getting rid of my stock springs??:confused::confused::nervous: After further discussion he was explaining that H&R are very soft in comparison and they never release (or at least make it very difficult) to attain their exact rates. Dick tested several of the commong Mfg and has all the rates logged. He pulled them for me and here is what we found:

Front - Stock = 298
Rear - Stock - 220

Front - H&R = 298
Rear - H&R = 188

You also need to factor in the amount of drop and with the additional that the H&R provide the actual rate needs to increase as well. Although they are the same in stock form the added drop makes them softer. Take that theory and look at the rear rates and it's even worse. He did say they are still developing theirs for the B5 platform and should be released shortly. The drop will be in the 1/2 - 3/4" area so the "look" may not be there but the performance will. The reason why the car feels so much better is mainly due to the Billstein's. Now I'm contemplating selling my H&R springs once they complete theirs. Anyone else have any additional input?
 

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That's freaky. I can't wrap my brain around it. Doesn't match up with real-world experience. My H&R OE Sport springs are stiffer than the stock springs. They just are.

:hmmm: :confused:
 

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The H&R's are dual-rate springs. If he's talking about the softer-rate section of the spring, I'd agree.

BTW I've been driving this car long enough now with the H&R's to be able to feel what the dual-rate springs are doing. I hate it. I want linear-rate springs so bad...

I experience a non-proportional increase in the amount of "jarring" with respect to the size of the bump. There's a whole size range of small bumps that are handled with no protest from the suspension. But you hit a bump just a little-bit bigger and, "WHUMP!" goes your suspension. I figure the only explanation for this is that the whump-bump bridges the transition between the softer and firmer coils. (?)

BTW the anti-roll bars may mask this behavior somewhat, maybe a lot of what. I had a sense beforehand, but wasn't able to pinpoint exactly how the suspension was behaving until I took them off.
 

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Rusty, I'm with you mine definitely feel stiffer but he does have the data logged and I trust his experience. He said that I'm simply feeling the difference in the Billstein damper vs. stock.. Who knows, at any rate, I too would love to have a linear rate setup on mine as well. I didn't ask him if the ones he was developing for the B5 were or not :confused: :confused:
 

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You sure, Rusty? I'm almost positive my H&R's weren't progressive...

Anyways, I disagree as well, and all those who have prematurely worn out their OEM shocks on H&R OE's probably feel the same way.
 
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