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2002 Volkswagen Passat Wagon GLX 4Motion
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
My 2002 ATQ 4mo wagon would not crank this morning. Radio and dash lights were fine but no starter, not even a little. Oddly, no electric windows either. Fuse 14 good. Battery voltage 12.5v drops to about 12.3v while key held. I can hear some relay clicking under there but not sure what.

Car ran fine yesterday for a sandwich run! (Thank goodness as waiting for AAA at 8pm last night would have sucked.)

Any magic to be suggested?

TIA,
Jack

After two hours...

Next steps...my first youtube of 'Passat no crank' turned up a problem in the wiring bundle in the driver side rocker panel and CCM...This might not be my cause but it doesn't look good.



The yellow with red and the red with blue are badly stripped.


Update and more photos...



Are these photos showing signs of a prior repair? Is that two red with blue stripe wires in one end and one out the other a splice or the way its built? The brown with black stripe, one of those red with blue stripes and another yellow with red stripe will need to be replaced and spliced. I've been practicing and getting my iron, solder. cutters, etc. together. At my age, I'll need some big ass magnifying goggles, too.

Fuse 14 continuity tested fine on the multimeter. There's no funky smell in the car...Had an Audi once with definite flood damage and the smell was rank...I mentioned in another thread that the heater core is disconnected at the firewall. That's the likely suspect but the core replacement is down the list of repairs.

The one other possible symptom is a 'Check brake' light that comes on sometimes but not most times. The pads have less than 15,000 miles on them.

Weather was decent today, so being on my knees was not the bite in the rear that I expected.


This is the youtube that made me suspect my harness...https://youtu.be/Mn9W9qqXHWo
 

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A short somewhere between the driver's side power window switches and motors and the under-dash relay panel is what finally killed my 1996 A4. Total short/meltdown/fry job of the wiring harness from door to kick panel and from kick panel to relay panel.
 

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I can't think of where to find it or what the real name is, but jumping the starter interlock relay will tell you if that's the issue. It's under the dash and was last referenced in a manual swap thread.
 

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Woo, that's a lot of corrosion! Get that cleaned up ASAP regardless. Guaranteed some splices are compromised. Anything else in the car not working? Did you test the fuse(s) with continuity/voltage or just inspect them?
 
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Woo, that's a lot of corrosion! Get that cleaned up ASAP regardless. Guaranteed some splices are compromised. Anything else in the car not working? Did you test the fuse(s) with continuity/voltage or just inspect them?
Visual inspection. A continuity test is easy enough. I spent the day reading/viewing enough about soldered splices to feel comfortable in doing it myself. Rainy in my part of NJ today. Got nothing done.
 

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To get it to start, you could remove relay #12 and connect a jumper across pins 30 to 87.

Locate and fix source of water ingress.
I suggest you completely unwrap all of the CCM harness and pull the wires apart to find the splices, any corroded splices need
to be cut back, soldered, and covered with marine grade heat shrink tubing. (You might need to add short wires to replace what you cut out)
Also check ground connections (1 on floor and on "A" Pillar), and check CCM/TCM and "A" Pillar connectors.
Have a good look at this link, before you start. (Note: This is a UK car, the CCM is always on the LHS)

This thread attempts to bring together all the problems regarding water ingress and their solutions.
Water Ingress and Solutions
 

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Sometimes it is obvious that a fuse is bad from a visual inspection, but you can never confirm that it is good.
The only sure ways to check fuses, is with a meter or test lamp.
 

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Sometimes it is obvious that a fuse is bad from a visual inspection, but you can never confirm that it is good.
The only sure ways to check fuses, is with a meter or test lamp.
Agreed. Also, fuses are cheap. When in doubt, replace it with a new one.
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Sometimes it is obvious that a fuse is bad from a visual inspection, but you can never confirm that it is good.
The only sure ways to check fuses, is with a meter or test lamp.
Multimeter says continuity is fine
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
Getting there...

Printed circuit board in the CCM looks good. No burned spots on the board, the one capacitor on the board looks good. Photos to follow if my phone ever sinks with gmail. The one of the two red/blue wires that are joined to one out was definitely burned through. The yellow/red wire had burned through the insulation and I just dabbed a little liquid tape onto that. There was 'some' moisture underneath the carpet but well forward of the CCM. I'm going to let it dry and try the Relay 12 jump start.



 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
My 2002 ATQ 4mo wagon would not crank this morning. Radio and dash lights were fine but no starter, not even a little. Oddly, no electric windows either. Fuse 14 good. Battery voltage 12.5v drops to about 12.3v while key held. I can hear some relay clicking under there but not sure what.

Car ran fine yesterday for a sandwich run! (Thank goodness as waiting for AAA at 8pm last night would have sucked.)

Any magic to be suggested?

TIA,
Jack

After two hours...

Next steps...my first youtube of 'Passat no crank' turned up a problem in the wiring bundle in the driver side rocker panel and CCM...This might not be my cause but it doesn't look good.



The yellow with red and the red with blue are badly stripped.


Update and more photos...



Are these photos showing signs of a prior repair? Is that two red with blue stripe wires in one end and one out the other a splice or the way its built? The brown with black stripe, one of those red with blue stripes and another yellow with red stripe will need to be replaced and spliced. I've been practicing and getting my iron, solder. cutters, etc. together. At my age, I'll need some big ass magnifying goggles, too.

Fuse 14 continuity tested fine on the multimeter. There's no funky smell in the car...Had an Audi once with definite flood damage and the smell was rank...I mentioned in another thread that the heater core is disconnected at the firewall. That's the likely suspect but the core replacement is down the list of repairs.

The one other possible symptom is a 'Check brake' light that comes on sometimes but not most times. The pads have less than 15,000 miles on them.

Weather was decent today, so being on my knees was not the bite in the rear that I expected.


This is the youtube that made me suspect my harness...https://youtu.be/Mn9W9qqXHWo
Mark this one as closed. Splicing the harness connector brought my starter back online. Getting the other CCM related functions back to a working state is for another time...Those shocks/spring and secondary air injection pump are calling!

Jack
 

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Mark this one as closed. Splicing the harness connector brought my starter back online. Getting the other CCM related functions back to a working state is for another time...Those shocks/spring and secondary air injection pump are calling!

Jack
Awesome! My rule of thumb with these cars: When you see any corroded wiring or nastiness, it is usually causing some type of issue and should be cleaned up/repaired before digging any deeper.
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Awesome! My rule of thumb with these cars: When you see any corroded wiring or nastiness, it is usually causing some type of issue and should be cleaned up/repaired before digging any deeper.
Pulling up half the carpet and looking for intrusion areas. If anyone had told me I'd work this hard on a 19 year old VW when I was in high school, I'd have laughed.

Is/was this a symptom of the German push for greater recycling of dead autos that causes the wiring harness issues in so many older Mercedes?
 

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Is/was this a symptom of the German push for greater recycling of dead autos that causes the wiring harness issues in so many older Mercedes?
The early 90s Mercedes switched to a bio-based engine wiring harness that self-destructed much sooner than planned.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
The early 90s Mercedes switched to a bio-based engine wiring harness that self-destructed much sooner than planned.
Oops...So there should be a ton of 90's-00s MB chassis just needing a completely new harness, right?
 

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Yes, it was the early 90s on the straight 6 gas engines only. They were over $1K to buy replacements. I don't know when they switched back to the better material.
 
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