[RCinSTP]

I apologize in advance, this is a dumb question. I replaced my front drivers side upper control arms. I replaced them because I had a knocking sound coming from the front end. That was a few weeks ago and the knocking sound stopped. I meant to check the passenger side but I forgot. Now I hear a similar knocking sound. When I look at the passenger side upper control arms, they look good. I grabbed each arm firmly and tried to twist the arm, rotate it along the length, the rear arm is solid, the front arm twists a tiny amount.
Is this the way to diagnose the control arms? Should they be rock solid?
Thanks

 

[wormybeech]

Jack it up so the wheel is off the ground. Grab the tire at 9 and 3 o'clock and wiggle it, like try to turn it right then left rapidly. There should be zero play in the joints.

 

[RCinSTP]

I thought that only diagnosed the tie rod end. What if the tie rod end is loose? Will the control arms still show some movement beyond what I get from a bad tie rod end?

 

[PZ]

That diagnoses the ball joint end of the upper control arms. To check the bushings, you just need to look at them. If they are cracked all the way around, they are shot. You will often see the arm displaced to the front or rear of center on the bushing. That is what causes the knocking. It hits the side of the upper control arm mounting plate.

 

[RCinSTP]

Thanks PZ, I will have a look at them later today. If they don't look cracked, should I try to twist them to see if there is any movement? I'm concerned that I won't be able to tell if they are bad. Maybe this is one of those things where it is easy tell, either they are cracked and look bad or they look fine, nothing subtle.

 

[AndreasPassat]

If you grab the upper control arms and twist them that wont tell you much. They should move, but because the arms are under tension it might be difficult to tell if the movement is good movement or bad.
When you the tire off the ground, grab at 3 and 9 o'clock positions and push back and forth at those positions. Essentially what you'll be doing is trying to turn the wheel like the steering moves the wheels.
While exerting back and forth on the tire, the tire and whole wheel assembly should not have any slop in it. You might actually move the position of the wheel if your steering wheel is un-locked, but you are looking for movement in the joints on the control arms.
Grabbing the tire at 6 and 12 o'clock and pushing back and forth will also check for play in the joints.

 

[boyesreef]

when they go bad on the inside, not the outside, it will give a weird wander while cornering. it will turn fine while coasting a corner but when power is applied, it will straighten out a little. its the movement in the bushing.

 

[RCinSTP]

Thank you, all of you. The tie rod end is bad, but when I try moving the wheel I don't notice any movement in the control arms. I think they are not really bad, just starting to go bad. It does look like there are cracks or tears in the bushings. I am going to go ahead and replace the control arms and tie rod end. I ordered the parts and I'm going to start soaking the pinch pin with PB Blaster.

 

[zak99B5]

Just do the entire front end with a control arm kit from FCP. Get it all refreshed and new at once.

 

[RCinSTP]

I already did the drivers side, but it was such a PITA that I was hoping I didn't need to do the passenger side, so, here I am, completing the job.

 

[zak99B5]

Upper and lower? And sway bar links? And tie rods?

 

[RCinSTP]

I only did the upper arms and the tie rod end on the drivers side and I am planning on doing the same on the passenger side. Should I replace the sway bar links? How can I tell if the sway bar link is worn out?

 

[zak99B5]

The rubber cracks and ages. Then it loses its bond with the metal, and you get clunking.

With the whole kit ~$250 shipped you get all new arms, inner and outer tie rod ends (get the S4 upgrade), sway bar links, and all the hardware needed.

Changing both parts of the tie rod makes it easier as you don't need to separate them. Also, you can make the new tie rod the same length as the original, which will get you very close to good alignment (assuming it was good to start).

The entire job is done, and you'll feel the difference.

 

[RCinSTP]

Thanks zak99B5, since I already did the drivers side uppers and tie rod end and I already bought the upper control arms and tie rod end for the passenger side, I can't buy the whole kit from FCP, but I will remember that for next time. By the way, who is FCP? Do you have a link?

 

[boyesreef]

The rubber cracks and ages. Then it loses its bond with the metal, and you get clunking.

With the whole kit ~$250 shipped you get all new arms, inner and outer tie rod ends (get the S4 upgrade), sway bar links, and all the hardware needed.

Changing both parts of the tie rod makes it easier as you don't need to separate them. Also, you can make the new tie rod the same length as the original, which will get you very close to good alignment (assuming it was good to start).

The entire job is done, and you'll feel the difference.

i didnt have clunking, until my tie rod end fell out.

 

[zak99B5]

i didnt have clunking, until my tie rod end fell out.

That was about the sway bar links, not TREs.

Well, RC, you are the poster child now for getting the whole set when you have control arm issues on an older Passat. Meaning, you should have done the whole shebang the first time, and you wouldn't be posting about this now. Not to be a dick or anything.

 

[AndreasPassat]

FCP is an online parts warehouse that sells everything VW. The actual site is https://www.fcpeuro.com/

Here is link directly to a set of upper controls arms for your car, based on what I saw in your profile.
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/audi-volkswagen-control-arm-kit-front-upper-audi4piececakit

There are also these other sites:
ecstuning.com

GermanAutoParts.com

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